[quote]He has always been excessively cruel to animals (he even shot and killed his own dog because it barked), obsessed with weapons, "charmingly" manipulative of adults, a pathological liar, disdainful of other people and abusive to them and VERY quick to anger. I mean, I purposefully avoided everything except a quick glance at the CNN and MSNBC frontpages, but they had stories about the anniversary pretty front and center. His parents didnt understand the full extent of it, but high school wasnt turning out to be a kind place for him. In the days after Dylan Klebold along with Eric Harris shot and killed 12 students and one teacher and then himself at Columbine High School on April 20, 1999, his mother, Sue Klebold, remembered . 6. The next deadliest school shooting (based on fatalities) was the Sandy Hook Elementary massacre in Newtown, Connecticut, with 27 fatalities. If only we would have asked the right questions." And then later on, how was he able to conceal his mental state so successfully? "I wonder if there was any homosex between those two.". Dylan takes the camera then and begins filming Eric. Parenting is the ultimate denial of responsibility because it is always the OTHER PARENT'S FAULT. See? I believe the parents both left the Columbine area, and possibly the state of Colorado. After sitting and waiting for 13 hours, I just needed to get home. Other way around. Dylan Klebold was suicidal for several years before Columbine. We had to get up at 4:00 AM to be there by 6:00. Bedwetting, firesetting and cruelty to animals. It's always about management. Do you think Dylans dad could embarrass him as a child in front of other people or humiliate him in other ways that could result in Dylans low self esteem or was Dylan naturally shy? The testimony people point out of a co-worker stating Dylan didnt get on with his father is unreliable as he couldve been having a teenage moan or joining in one time right up to regular bitterly disparaging remarks and reasons why. She also spent a lot of time conferencing with my teachers to know how well I was doing in school and she was interested in my assignments. I'm not saying that there's no guilt, no responsibility, because no matter how our brains are wired, we're all creatures of free will and able to make moral choices, but to lay everything at the feet of society, or the parents, or the school, is way, way too simple. I just wanted to apologize to you guys for any crap this might instigate as far as (inaudible) or something. That's the first thing. The parents of Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17, remained in seclusion Wednesday as a global media horde encamped at their houses after the murderous rampage Tuesday at Columbine High School. Now everybody expects the schools to fix everything for them. Born: 4-9-1981. Was Tom there for him when he needed him? Dylan was giddy and beaming, all cleaned up for once. Isaiah's father said. Subject: Re: Dylan's house google earth Tue May 10, 2016 10:18 pm. Talking about the home video they took of that day, Its absolutely stunning how normal Dylan seems (p. 235). We are not there yet. Eric's dad answered a phone call from Green Mountain Guns. Hey, Sci-fi-tologist, fuck off with your anti-psychology bullshit. If anything, they seemed to hate everyone equally. The oblivious parents in Target or sitting inside their houses listening to their kids having a meltdown and completely ignoring it. Hey mom, gotta go Tom isnt even included in the insincere goodbye. x93Thatx94 happened to x93themx94 because they were bad parents, we could tell ourselves. As his father's career pulled him out of schools and away from friends leaving Plattsburgh, New York in 1993 for Colorado Harris increasingly retreated into the computer and . He was fiercely independent, insisting his mother teach him how to bathe himself at the age of 5 or 6, and how to do his own laundry at age 10. As I often do, Ill leave the author the last word on why understanding the process her son went through is important: Dylan was vulnerable in many ways unquestionably emotionally immature, depressed, possibly suffering from a more serious mood or personality disorder. They have grown up to be (somewhat) upstanding members of society, but I don't see how it is so easy to go from knowing your kid is making crank calls and setting off amateur pipe bombs to seeing him as a psychopathic murderer. Not only had Dylan experienced bullying in school, his school fit some of the factors that meant it was most at risk for a shooting by ignoring certain behaviors and otherwise unevenly enforcing the rules. How can that not bother you? Psychiatry has long attacked outsiders of all kinds, including gays, while not saying a word about society. r109 is quick to dismiss r108 as a "troll". Brookscolumn did not say when and where the interview took place. Very exciting though, the progress we've made. ", "R77, there are people who don't have feelings.". FULL DOCO - PT 2 OF 3, 2. Dylan is wearing a black baseball cap on backward, exposing a "B" embroidered in white on the back of the hat - the Boston Red Sox logo. They could still have been on the outskirts of the school. How they could live with themselves is beyond me. He did it in contradiction to the way he was raised.. There was a creepy thread started by a sociopathic OP a couple of weeks ago where this was discussed. That kid was born with some sort of brain injury. These two need to be gutted and hung out for the vultures. On August 30, 2006 Columbine obsessed 18 year old Alvaro Castillo would murder his father with a sawed off Mossberg 500 shotgun at their home and then drive to a local high school and open fire. [quote]Dang, I'm unemployed and I wanted to watch today's Oprah about Columbine. Here's what you need to know: 1. Eric: "Susan, sorry. It would be comforting to think otherwise. She is the author of A Mother's Reckoning, a book about the signs she missed of Dylan's mental state. Oprah asked the teachers to describe Harris/Klebold, the teachers talked about how they didn't fit in, wore trenchcoats, seemed troubled and dangerous, and so on. Too bad. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold was the deadliest high school shooting in U.S. history, . The couple took issue with people who say they forgive them for what happened. On a calendar entry dated the day of the attack, April 20, the time 11:10 is written across the top an approximate reference to when Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold pulled out their weapons . Everyone ones there to be one systemic cause, one thing that failed, to point to and say "there, that's why this happened." It is also true that environmental stimuli can make the difference between a kid with "problems" and a kid who becomes a "monster." For a couple reasons. Harris' family eventually settled in Colorado in 1992. Im horrified, Dawn Anna, whose daughter Lauren Townsend was killed at Columbine, told The Associated Press. Eric is filming. [] Asking why only makes us feel hopeless. Ericx92s parents knew their son was no angel x97 he broke into a van, he was found making pipe bombs and setting them off for fun x97 and they took steps to address this. They weren't bullied, and they weren't outcasts; all of that came from the non-stop media echo chamber that followed the events. Over time, they became increasingly close, hanging out by often going out bowling, carpooling and playing the video game Doom over a private server connected to their personal computers. I'm glad Oprah isn't going to help this man promote his book. While in class we have made abundantly clear that most people with mental health issues are non-violent, Dylans depression and suicidality fits the school shooter pattern. He was kind, gentle, smart, and happy. Dylan Klebold's father contacted authorities, saying the boy might be involved and offering to help, Jefferson County District Attorney Dave . A Mothers Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy. . What a twat. AAron Ontiveroz/the Denver Post via Getty Images She went to Ohio State University where she dated Tom. On Dylan's part, I think that in January 1999, he was depressed and preparing to die - distancing himself from those he loved, so that it would be easier for him to carry out the attack. With these many, many factors in mind, I turn to A Mothers Reckoning. Klebold and Harris were in a juvenile diversion program for breaking into a van and stealing tools and other items in January 1998. She's spent years excavating every detail of her family life, trying to understand what she could have done to prevent her son's violence. And while his father was the epitome of the military asshole, having to deal with him only served to hone Eric's skills in fooling people. I just don't get it. Attacks seem planned in advance, with the shooter expecting to be killed or planning to commit suicide in conjunction with the attack. These are all great examples of Tom's relationship with Dylan. His parents knew this, though not the extent of it. When I hear this "We never knew a thing was wrong with our child!" Im looking for possible warning signs of trouble between these two individuals and their father-son relationship. Per the other Columbine thread, I'm in the midst of reading Dave Cullen's "Columbine." (talks about his mother being thoughtful, bringing him candy and Slim Jims) "I really am sorry about all this. His parents were Wayne Harris and his wife Katherine Ann Poole. Ten years after the Columbine killings, the Harris family has not spoken publicly at all, and the Klebold parents have given one interview, to the columnist David Brooks here at the New York Times. (p. 311-312) Synthesizing the many factors, its argued that most school shooters have a history of social rejection, along with either psychological problems, an interest in weapons, and/or a fascination with death (p. 314). . Wayne & Kathy Harris' son is widely seen as the . Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Eric: "Yea Everyone I love, I'm really sorry about all this. On April 20, 1999, two teenage gunmen kill 13 people in a shooting spree at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado, south of Denver. ", Eric "If only we would have searched their room. Dylan Klebold's mother: 'I felt I was a good mom'. 18 year old son of Wayne Nelson Harris and Katherine (Kathy) Ann [Pool] Harris. When it came to intervention, these people had no idea what they should have been doing. Find it interesting Tom would say he was Dylan's best friend. The bombing was planned for April 19th, to coincide with the Oklahoma bombing, but for some reason, they were set back to the 20th. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Similiarly if a child is screaming at playmates and/or siblings and will not stop, you have to move in and take control of the situation. I remember Oprah had teachers and students from Columbine on her show within a month of the event. Klebold and Dylan's father, Tom, endured not only . I'm sorry, all right. He has always been excessively cruel to animals (he even shot and killed his own dog because it barked), obsessed with weapons, "charmingly" manipulative of adults, a pathological liar, disdainful of other people and abusive to them and VERY quick to anger. People need to understand this could have happened to them, he said. They haff come here to haff a nice dinner und a nice time. I was just messing with you all a little bit in my other posts. And it wasnx92t because they werenx92t around. On April 20, 1999, when Sue Klebold heard about a shooting incident at Columbine High School, her thoughts immediately turned to her 17-year-old son, Dylan, who was a senior there. As the son of a geophysicist father and a mother who worked with the disabled, his upper-middle-class upbringing and well-meaning family didn't seem like contributing factors to his eventual killing spree. His father was an Air Force pilot, and moved him and his . I think maybe his outlook grew worse over time. 'Toxic culture' blamedHe was hopeless. in CJ 725, Tagged: columbine, mass murderer, mental illness, school shootings. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that most serial killers/mass murderers had excessive discipline rather than lenient upbringings. Those kids were their responsibility legally. ", Eric: (shrugs) "My parents might have made some mistakes that they weren't really aware of. He was enrolled in a program for juvenile offenders run by the county court, he was taken to a psychiatrist and given both therapy and medication. In the April 24 column, Brooks had paraphrased an article in the online publication Slate that said Harris and Klebold yearned to become the most prolific mass murders in history. Adam killed 20 children and 6 adults at Sandy Hook Elementary. Sue and her husband were vehemently opposed, but Dylan still asked for a gun for Christmas his final year. The world was shocked and sickened on April 20, 1991, when crazed students Dylan Klebold, 17, and Eric Harris, 18, slaughtered 12 students and one teacher at Colorado's Columbine High School. Neither seemed to know where or with whom he was most of the time. By his junior and senior years, Dylans parents knew something was wrong. In this difficult, jarring talk, Klebold explores the intersection between mental health and violence . In a story for Sundays editions of The Post, Lozow related the first moments after the Klebolds learned of the shooting. I read recently that neither set of parents ever spoke publicly or to the media. Okay, well, first of all, gifted programs don't monitor shit. I read a lot of opinions on Eric and his dad Wayne. If there is a hell, they are there, burning. It Always seems like he didn't give a damn about them, in his writings and in the Basement Tapes. No, they hated the gay boys almost as much as they hated the jocks. And society does not want to deal with real problems, so it easier to label people, and just forget about the whole thing. Ed Berg, a former business associate who has talked to Tom Klebold since the shootings, said Dylan's father has come to grips with the boy's crime. Posted February 7, 2011. Theres to me a level of skepticism we have usually of course with the scraps of info we had, but also the slight weirdness/more to it/unreliability when it came down to this particular topic, Find it interesting Tom would say he was Dylans best friend. Dylan's mother, Sue Klebold, confirmed to radio host Terry Gross on "Fresh Air" Tuesday that she is Jewish, and her now ex-husband, Dylan Klebold's father, is Lutheran, and said her son . His dad followed him around with a camcorder, capturing every move. This was murder, he said. How do you teach someone to have emotions or empathy? (21 at the time). one of their coworkers at blackjack (again, cannot remember the name; most of this is just top of my head knowledge but it was a girl) said that dylan was not close with his dad and even disliked him (something to that effect), also in the 11k. It would drive me insane to have my kids behave like that, but some people are utterly oblivious to the cacaphony and strife being caused by their children. But a new book, x93Columbine,x94 by Dave Cullen, reviews every bit of evidence about the shooting short of the parentsx92 firsthand accounts x97 25,000 pages of documents, including videotapes and journals of the killers x97 all of which point to the same chilling conclusion as the Carneal depositions: it is entirely possible for x93goodx94 parents to raise a murderer. Sue is from a prominent Jewish community . LITTLETON, Colo. (AP) _ Columbine High School gunman Dylan Klebold was a follower, not a leader, who went astray after he met Eric Harris, friends say. In general: School shootings happen most at high schools, with a student at the school acting alone as the shooter. "If a person was denying it, he would say, 'One of . Brooks Brown, now 31 years-old was a senior at Columbine during what was considered to be the worst school shooting in U.S. history. His mom was trying to find the best fit for him, but I suspect it ended up being more difficult for him), and both enjoyed violent video games. Eric David Harris and Dylan Bennet Klebold were a pair of school shooters, bombers, and mass murderers responsible for the April 20, 1999 Columbine High School Massacre in Columbine, Colorado, which killed thirteen people and wounded 21 others before ending with both of their suicides. As a reporter scribbled, Hooker reconsidered. Bratty kids in Target are not mass murderers in the making. Cullen, who covered the story for the former Rocky Mountain News, seems to take the view that the Harrises were willfully ignorant of their son's personality (and Major Wayne Harris honestly seems like a bit of a tyrant), and the Klebolds were just clueless. And then later on, how was he able to conceal his mental state so successfully? Shocking crime scene photos explode the myths and reveal shocking details! Dylan says people will note the date and time when watching it. R16 = Female with daddy issues who doesn't take kindly to unkind remarks toward her fellow twats. People can be fooled. We are ich bin auslander! This is my (completely layman's) opinion, but I've always figured that we have more or less tamped down the "How" of the brain, but we're still working on the "Why" of the brain. To be clear, I'm sure the Klebold's obviously loved their children, but reading Dylan's writings, there was more going on in that home that Sue would say today. Or is your tiny mind only capable of two viewpoints? WTF?!? His father Wayne was a U.S. Air Force transport pilot . That's the first thing. I worked as a dishwasher, then busboy then waiter in a German-American restaurant years ago when I was growing up. r54 is right. "Doctors" can profit, too, financially, when their names are attached to certain "studies.". His father was a geophysicist and a mother worked with the disabled . of course, tom has never come out and publicly spoken the way sue has; from my personal observation he seems to be a little more torn up about it than she. Harris parents, Wayne and Kathy Harris, have never spoken to reporters. Let's set aside the pipe bomb issue and Eric's scrapes with the law for a moment and ask why they weren't more involved with their kid. In a video-diary-style recording, Dylan stated his parents had been good to him. [quote]Did Harris or Klebold have any siblings? As we ourselves have often concluded in class, it seems Sue also came to the understanding that the massacre was the culmination of a number of different factors for Dylan, none of which on their own would have created such an act. These kids were calculating, smart and intent on destruction. Tom's surgery was today. Bull fucking shit. In the vacuum of actual news, they just start over again. His negative traits werent out of the ordinary either, really: he was very sensitive to embarrassment, which sometimes led to anger; and he was perhaps a little too independent, where he wouldnt ask for help even if he needed it like when he had to take a break from baseball after pains he never mentioned became so bad they caused his arm real damage. Hers was a love as dark and true, as embracing and self-abnegating, as Cordelia's. On April 20, 1999, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, seniors at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colo., placed .
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